January 6th committee hears testimony on Trump’s election fraud claims, pressure on Pence to overturn election results

How do you feel about the January 6th select committee’s hearings?

Written by Eric Revell, Countable News

What’s the story?

  • The Select Committee to Investigate the January 6th Attack on the U.S. Capitol held two public hearings this week in its ongoing probe into the riot that delayed the certification of the 2020 presidential election and then-President Donald Trump’s efforts to overturn the outcome of the election.
  • Monday’s hearing was focused on Trump’s unsubstantiated claims of widespread election fraud that prevented him from winning re-election in the lead-up to January 6th. Thursday’s hearing centered on Trump’s unsuccessful efforts to pressure Vice President Mike Pence into rejecting state election results during the certification of the Electoral College to tip the outcome in his favor. Here’s a recap of some of the key moments:

Monday, June 13th Hearing

  • The hearing featured video testimony from the deposition of former Attorney General Bill Barr, who told the committee that Trump’s conspiracies about Dominion voting machines were “bulls---”, “crazy stuff”, and “complete nonsense”. He said those claims along with other efforts to cast doubt on the legitimacy of the election were “doing great, great disservice to the country”. 
  • Barr said his view at the time prior to his resignation from the Justice Dept. was that if Trump really believes his claims about the voting machines “he’s become detached from reality.”
  • Trump’s political advisors testified that the president was informed he had lost the election and the campaign’s legal arm told his team the amount of fraud in the election wasn’t enough to alter the outcome. Matthew Morgan, who was the Trump campaign’s general counsel, testified:
“Generally discussed on that topic was whether the fraud, maladministration, abuse, or irregularities, if aggregated and read most favorably to the campaign, would that be outcome determinative? And I think everyone’s assessment in the room, at least among the staff, Marc Short, myself, and Greg Jacob, was that it was not sufficient to be outcome determinative.”
  • The hearing also examined some of the specific allegations of election fraud. Bjay Pak, who served as U.S. Attorney for the Northern District of Georgia and was appointed by Trump to that role, testified that an alleged “suitcase full of ballots” that was the source of some election fraud conspiracies focused on Georgia was actually a “lockbox to make sure ballots were kept safe”.
  • Monday’s hearing also involved a discussion of the substantial amount of money raised by Trump’s campaign through the use of election fraud claims during the period leading up to January 6th. The committee said about $250 million was raised by the Trump campaign in that period, and Rep. Zoe Lofgren (D-CA) told CNN that some of his family members benefited from the “grift” like Kimberly Guilfoyle, who spoke at the January 6th rally and reportedly received $60,000. 
  • You can watch the full committee hearing here.

Thursday, June 16th Hearing

  • The hearing featured testimony from several aides and advisors to Vice President Mike Pence regarding the pressure President Trump exerted on him to use his role as the president of the Senate to disregard states’ election results during the certification of the Electoral College. Pence has consistently asserted that he had no constitutional authority to reject election results. The committee showed a video of a recent speech given by Pence in which he said: 
“There is almost no idea more un-American than the notion that any one person could choose the American president.”
  • John Eastman, a lawyer who advised Trump during his attempt to block the certification of the Electoral College, was shown invoking his Fifth Amendment right to avoid self-incrimination during his deposition before the committee. Eastman had argued in memos, “The fact is that the Constitution assigns this power to the Vice President as the ultimate arbiter.”
  • Greg Jacob, Pence’s counsel, testified that he asked Eastman how the Supreme Court would rule if Pence did what Trump’s team asked him to, and he said that Eastman replied, “Well, yeah, you’re right, we would lose 9-nothing.” The select committee also released an email from Eastman to Rudy Giuliani seeking a presidential pardon from Trump following January 6th. The pardon wasn't granted.
  • During the hearing, it was revealed by Rep. Pete Aguilar (D-CA) that the mob of rioters who invaded the Capitol was within 40 feet of Vice President Pence. The mob at times chanted, “Hang Mike Pence,” and Aguilar said that a Justice Dept. court filing cites a confidential informant who asserted that some of the Proud Boys present would’ve killed Pence if given the opportunity.
  • You can watch the full committee hearing here.

What’s next?

  • Further hearings are scheduled for Tuesday, June 21st, and Thursday, June 23rd, both of which will occur at 1 p.m. Eastern. Topics are expected to include Trump’s efforts to pressure the Dept. of Justice (DOJ) and to reverse state election results, along with a going through a detailed timeline of his actions on January 6th.
  • It’s unclear whether the select committee will make a criminal referral of former President Trump or anyone else to the DOJ.  
  • Later this summer or sometime in the fall, the select committee is expected to issue a full report with its findings, including recommendations for legislation to avoid a similar attempt to subvert the certification of the Electoral College in the future.


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(Photo Credit: Tyler Merbler via Flickr / Creative Commons)